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Thread: Question to beheronow about retinoids for type 1

  1. #1
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    Default Question to beheronow about retinoids for type 1

    Hey beherenow,

    i cant sent you a message therefore i have to contact you this way. i personally deal with type 1 and have also found different literature claiming that retinoids like tretinoin are highly beneficial in rosacea type 1.
    There is also a publication from the dermatologist you mentioned (MT Pelle, Rosacea: II. Therapy) in which she explains that from her personal experience flushing is normalized after a year of tretinoin use.

    My question to you is, did she told you more about the effect of tretinoin on flushing?

  2. #2
    Senior Member Mistica's Avatar
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    There is a newer and supposedly less irritating form of Vitamin A available now.

    I have never used it and don't intend to. Nor am I endorsing it.

    Just sharing some information I came across.

    https://incidecoder.com/ingredients/...lone-retinoate.

    I stumbled across it when looking at a few photos of people with what appeared to be type two rosacea and possible peri-oral dermatitis, but that is just a guess.

    The product concerned was joyome, but this also contains a bucket load of other ingredients.

    The ordinary appear to sell Hydroxypinacolone Retinoate alone, however.


    If anyone is interested in the above mentioned photos of people using joyome for rosacea and PO Derm, here is one of the FB links. You'll have to wade through the anti wrinkle and acne photos as well to find them.
    To be honest I can't recall if the photos are all on the same FB page or not.

    https://www.facebook.com/pg/Beccasjoyome/posts/
    Previous Numerous IPL.
    Supplements: Niacinamide, Vit K2, low D3, Vit A. Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Very low dose B's. Low dose zinc (to correct deficiency).
    Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA 2%, ethyl ascorbate 2%.

    Treating for gut dysbiosis.(This is helping).
    Previous GAPS diet. Have now introduced lots of fibre.
    Fermented Foods. Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.
    Oral Colostrum. Helps reduce food reactions.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Tom Busby's Avatar
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    There are 2 forms of Vitamin A, water soluble and fat soluble: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11591229/

    For topical use, I prefer 0.05% of the water soluble type. The concentration I use, 0.05%, is identical to the concentration of retinyl palmitate in prescription eyedrops and therefore is on the hyper-safe side for use on skin -- in my experience this concentration doesn't cause any skin redness, even in the sun, but it's enough to visibly increase dead cell turnover on the surface of the epidermis (increased keratin-shedding).

  4. #4
    Senior Member Mistica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Busby View Post
    There are 2 forms of Vitamin A, water soluble and fat soluble: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11591229/

    For topical use, I prefer 0.05% of the water soluble type. The concentration I use, 0.05%, is identical to the concentration of retinyl palmitate in prescription eyedrops and therefore is on the hyper-safe side for use on skin -- in my experience this concentration doesn't cause any skin redness, even in the sun, but it's enough to visibly increase dead cell turnover on the surface of the epidermis (increased keratin-shedding).
    That is the form that turned my very mild and controlled rosacea into a flaming inferno with SEVERE flushing. I used it back in mid 2007 and by November, life as I knew it was over. I have never fully recovered. And of course there have been other disasters along the way due to my attempts to induce remission. A pipe dream, I imagine.

    I also react badly to oral vitamin A supplementation, even after an initial period of improvement.

    My point being, I don't think there are any forms of Vitamin A used topically, in particular, that should be considered safe for rosaceans and/or flushers but I realise a small number of people may find something tolerable and even, perhaps helpful.

    Of note: The TRPV1 receptor gene is overly expressed in type one skin and hypersensitive to normal stimuli. Retinoids are agonists of this receptor. I can't help but feel this is a bad thing.
    Last edited by Mistica; 19th July 2020 at 03:41 AM.
    Previous Numerous IPL.
    Supplements: Niacinamide, Vit K2, low D3, Vit A. Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Very low dose B's. Low dose zinc (to correct deficiency).
    Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA 2%, ethyl ascorbate 2%.

    Treating for gut dysbiosis.(This is helping).
    Previous GAPS diet. Have now introduced lots of fibre.
    Fermented Foods. Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.
    Oral Colostrum. Helps reduce food reactions.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mistica View Post
    That is the form that turned my very mild and controlled rosacea into a flaming inferno with SEVERE flushing. I used it back in mid 2007 and by November, life as I knew it was over. I have never fully recovered. And of course there have been other disasters along the way due to my attempts to induce remission. A pipe dream, I imagine.

    I also react badly to oral vitamin A supplementation, even after an initial period of improvement.

    My point being, I don't think there are any forms of Vitamin A used topically, in particular, that should be considered safe for rosaceans and/or flushers but I realise a small number of people may find something tolerable and even, perhaps helpful.

    Of note: The TRPV1 receptor gene is overly expressed in type one skin and hypersensitive to normal stimuli. Retinoids are agonists of this receptor. I can't help but feel this is a bad thing.
    That's one of the ingredients in a non prescription rosacea cream I made a thread about. I won't risk using it then because at the moment my rosacea is somewhat manageable. Why would that be an ingredient in a product made specifically for rosacea if it can make things worse?

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