Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 19

Thread: My Story + ZZ Cream question (with pics)

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    28
    Country: United States

    Default My Story + ZZ Cream question (with pics)

    Hi all,

    I'm a long-time rosacea type 1 sufferer (flushing on cheeks and ears; never had any P&Ps). I have gained a tremendous amount of insight from this site and from individual PMs with folks (thanks Nat007, Antwantsclear and IowaDave) and want to document my trial with ZZ Cream.

    For background: I've had rosacea for 20 years, I'm a 34 year old male with fair skin. Rosacea runs in my family. Mine was exacerbated by Retin-A use and accutane in my mid-20s. It also went into remission for about 6 years when I lived in California (warm weather) but came back with a vengence when I used accutane at 27 and moved to the US East Coast (very cold winters).

    I have found a lot of relief from my regimen, but cannot kick a persistent evening warm room flush of the cheeks and ears on most nights. My regimen is: Propranolol 120ER, Plaquenil, Anti-Inflammatory diet (lots veggies, no sugar / carbs), Red Light daily. I had one IPL treatment last month which I think helped but then I got nervous reading negative stories about it so I decided to put it on hold.

    I just recently learned about Demodex and have no idea if they are a problem for me, but I've decided to try ZZ Cream. I've been on it for four days. I am not allergic to it (I did a test on inner arm). I like the way it feels on my face, calming and soothing. Today I woke up and I have 4-5 small pimples on my cheeks / nose and little bit of ichyness. From what I understand this might be a good sign (Demodex are dying) but wanted to get thoughts from folks here.

    Heres pics of the pimples and itchy area:IMG_1849.jpgIMG_1850.jpgIMG_1851.jpg

    For reference here is a bad flush: IMG_1676.jpg

    Thanks all for any input!

  2. #2
    Senior Member Brady Barrows's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Honolulu, HI, USA
    Posts
    4,730

    Default

    Yes, you may be experiencing a die-off of the mites. It usually takes a month to see improvement, and three months for clearance. A recent study compared sulfur-sodium sulfacetamide combination with crotamiton and permethrin and resulted in "The patient satisfaction was higher in the sodium acetamide group than the 10% crotamiton and 5% permethrin groups, and clinical evaluation (erythema/ papulopustules and white plugs) was better in the sodium acetamide group than the other groups but no statistically significant difference was found in terms of patient satisfaction and clinical evaluation." The study concluded, "The sulfur-sodium combination, crotamiton, and permethrin are the three agents commonly used in the treatment of Demodex spp. and all significantly decreased the Demodex count. The three agents were similar in terms of tolerability.

    The ZZ cream contains sublimed sulphur. Stick with it and keep us posted.
    Brady Barrows
    Join the RRDi

  3. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    28
    Country: United States

    Default

    Thanks Brady! I will do so. I have learned a lot from your posts as well and from your book

  4. #4
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    28
    Country: United States

    Default

    Hi all - today is 5th or 6th day on ZZ Cream. The first two nights I used it very sparingly with water, and the last few nights I have used it much more generously.

    Last night I felt like my face and hairline were itching. I am noticing that I have more pimple-like things on my face that itch. This is very out of the ordinary for me. I have never itched or had pimples since puberty 20 years ago (my only rosacea symptom is flushing, no P&Ps).

    See pics below. Does this seem normal after 5 or 6 days on ZZ Cream? Good or bad sign?

    IMG_1856.jpgIMG_1857.jpg

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MP1985 View Post
    Hi all - today is 5th or 6th day on ZZ Cream. The first two nights I used it very sparingly with water, and the last few nights I have used it much more generously.

    Last night I felt like my face and hairline were itching. I am noticing that I have more pimple-like things on my face that itch. This is very out of the ordinary for me. I have never itched or had pimples since puberty 20 years ago (my only rosacea symptom is flushing, no P&Ps).

    See pics below. Does this seem normal after 5 or 6 days on ZZ Cream? Good or bad sign?

    IMG_1856.jpgIMG_1857.jpg
    I would treat your scalp at the same time with tea tree oil shampoo, as otherwise the demodex mites will move from your face to your scalp, and back to your face as soon as there isn't zhongzhou cream there. This is my favourite one - not sure it's available in the US:
    https://www.amazon.com/Thursday-Plan...r=8-4-fkmrnull

    Other people may suggest other tea tree oil shampoos. I think it may not be a coincidence that you are experiencing problems around the hairline.

    I used to use ZZ cream generously, but I found this is more likely to lead to dry skin etc - which can actually encourage flushing etc - because you want the strongest skin barrier possible, and dry/impaired skin encourages flushing. You want to cover the whole area of the face, not just the rosacea affected areas, but quite a thin watery layer should be enough if you continue to apply it night after night.
    Last edited by antwantsclear; 11th May 2019 at 08:22 AM.

  6. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    28
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by antwantsclear View Post
    I would treat your scalp at the same time with tea tree oil shampoo, as otherwise the demodex mites will move from your face to your scalp, and back to your face as soon as there isn't zhongzhou cream there. This is my favourite one - not sure it's available in the US:
    https://www.amazon.com/Thursday-Plan...r=8-4-fkmrnull

    Other people may suggest other tea tree oil shampoos. I think it may not be a coincidence that you are experiencing problems around the hairline.

    I used to use ZZ cream generously, but I found this is more likely to lead to dry skin etc - which can actually encourage flushing etc - because you want the strongest skin barrier possible, and dry/impaired skin encourages flushing. You want to cover the whole area of the face, not just the rosacea affected areas, but quite a thin watery layer should be enough if you continue to apply it night after night.
    Thanks Ant! I ordered the Tea Tree Shampoo but it is about a month shipping from Australia In the meantime, I see others talking about Borax shampoo, is that a good option? Maybe also the almond oil / tea tree oil scalp therapy I saw you mention before?

    If others have good tea tree shampoos they can recommend it would be appreciated!

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MP1985 View Post
    Thanks Ant! I ordered the Tea Tree Shampoo but it is about a month shipping from Australia In the meantime, I see others talking about Borax shampoo, is that a good option? Maybe also the almond oil / tea tree oil scalp therapy I saw you mention before?

    If others have good tea tree shampoos they can recommend it would be appreciated!
    I use the tea tree oil shampoo for convenience as it is already made up, but yes borax shampoo should work well. It is also harder to obtain borax in Europe than the US, so that is an advantage for you in making the shampoo.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Brady Barrows's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Honolulu, HI, USA
    Posts
    4,730

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MP1985 View Post
    Hi all - today is 5th or 6th day on ZZ Cream. The first two nights I used it very sparingly with water, and the last few nights I have used it much more generously.

    Last night I felt like my face and hairline were itching. I am noticing that I have more pimple-like things on my face that itch. This is very out of the ordinary for me. I have never itched or had pimples since puberty 20 years ago (my only rosacea symptom is flushing, no P&Ps).

    See pics below. Does this seem normal after 5 or 6 days on ZZ Cream? Good or bad sign?

    IMG_1856.jpgIMG_1857.jpg
    With most treatments that target killing the mites the usual report is that 'it gets worse before it gets better'. Hang in there. Usually it takes a month to see improvement, and twelve weeks for clearance. Then maintenance is required since the mites return. You can never really get rid of them. The best you can do is reduce their numbers. If you read this Russian paper on demodex, it concluded, "When comparing the efficacy of the therapy, it was found that statistically significantly more Demodex mites were found after treatment with confocal laser scanning in vivo microscopy (P≤0.05) (Table 7)." What this means is that after thirty days of eradicating the mites, they discovered the mites INCREASED, yet their rosacea IMPROVED. There is now a lot more we know about demodex, since most papers in the past did not understand the role demodex plays with humans, but now it is known that some symbiotic relationship exists (the mites benefit from ingesting sebum) in most humans, but somehow when their numbers increase become a pathogen in demodectic rosacea. The latest information discovered something totally new and states, “Our results also show for the first time that Demodex mites secrete bioactive molecules that reduced TLR2 expression in sebocytes.”
    Brady Barrows
    Join the RRDi

  9. #9
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    28
    Country: United States

    Default

    The last two nights when I applied the cream I started to have a stinging / burning feeling on my face which was not there the first 3 nights. My face got red and irritated. I have the pimple things which look like they could be die off, but I think it is also irritating my skin and giving me a burning feeling. Didn't feel right. And my resting redness is significantly worse now.

    I do not think I am allergic to it because I have done a patch test on my inner arm where I put the cream every day gratuitously and I have no reaction.

    One thing I forgot to mention is my skin is very dry. I struggle to keep it moist even during normal times. Perhaps the ZZ Cream is causing too much dryness which is irritating me. I am already using Skinceuticals Epidermal Repair on top of ZZ Cream and in the morning.

    My idea is this: do ZZ Cream ever other night, and on off nights do Tea Tree Oil + Emu Oil mask (this is what I'm using on my scalp now). Would that be OK and still be effective against the mites?

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MP1985 View Post
    The last two nights when I applied the cream I started to have a stinging / burning feeling on my face which was not there the first 3 nights. My face got red and irritated. I have the pimple things which look like they could be die off, but I think it is also irritating my skin and giving me a burning feeling. Didn't feel right. And my resting redness is significantly worse now.

    I do not think I am allergic to it because I have done a patch test on my inner arm where I put the cream every day gratuitously and I have no reaction.

    One thing I forgot to mention is my skin is very dry. I struggle to keep it moist even during normal times. Perhaps the ZZ Cream is causing too much dryness which is irritating me. I am already using Skinceuticals Epidermal Repair on top of ZZ Cream and in the morning.

    My idea is this: do ZZ Cream ever other night, and on off nights do Tea Tree Oil + Emu Oil mask (this is what I'm using on my scalp now). Would that be OK and still be effective against the mites?
    Its definitely true that Zhongzhou cream can have a drying effect on the skin, so you could not use it every third night or even every other night. And if the skin becomes too dry then the skin will flush more and become more irritated, so it's a balance. I would try tea tree oil and almond oil every 2-3 days, a dilute concentration e.g. 1:4 because you don't want to irritate the skin. I find emu oil irritating, but you may find it works ok for you - it is quite heavy so can clog the skin. You can also reduce the drying effect of ZZ through applying it with a wet finger and very lightly on to a slightly wet face. You'll also find less irritation the more you follow a low carbohydrate diet. Maybe try taking a break every three to four days if you are getting too much dryness as well.
    Last edited by antwantsclear; 14th May 2019 at 05:10 PM.

Similar Threads

  1. My Story with ZZ Cream
    By chchchanging in forum Topical and oral products (non-prescription)
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: 29th April 2016, 05:38 PM
  2. A story and a big question mark
    By smart2005ct in forum Erythematotelangiectatic Rosacea
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 22nd January 2016, 10:35 PM
  3. pics before and after zz cream
    By tatejones in forum Topical and oral products (non-prescription)
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 1st December 2015, 10:26 PM
  4. Aloha! Sorta new here! Story and pics inside.
    By UnwelcomeBlush in forum Newbie questions / Introduction
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 19th January 2014, 01:28 AM
  5. My story and pics. Rosacea? Seb Derm?
    By dan pacifik in forum Photos
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 28th July 2009, 11:22 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •