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Thread: KPRF, LRP-1 and Metalloproteinases

  1. #31
    Senior Member Mistica's Avatar
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    Hi Mistica, Does drinking green tea give you a bad reaction, too?

    I brew it and let ot cool, but it seems to make me flushed or red.
    Hi,

    Yes, it does. I loathe all tea with a passion. I find the taste awful, but seeing some teas are supposed to have health benefits, green in particular, I decided to try a supplement. The supplement causes more flushing but the worse thing is, for me, the baseline redness increases, as happened due to my recent experiment. The only reason I tried it again was the hope that my body may have become more tolerant these days.
    Previous Numerous IPL.
    Supplements: Niacinamide, Vit K2, low D3, Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Very low dose B's. Low dose zinc (to correct deficiency).
    Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA.

    Treating for gut dysbiosis under specialist care. (This is helping).
    Previous GAPS diet. Testing tolerance of resistant starch.
    Fermented Foods. 2 to 3 days per week, Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mistica View Post
    Hi,

    Yes, it does. I loathe all tea with a passion. I find the taste awful, but seeing some teas are supposed to have health benefits, green in particular, I decided to try a supplement. The supplement causes more flushing but the worse thing is, for me, the baseline redness increases, as happened due to my recent experiment. The only reason I tried it again was the hope that my body may have become more tolerant these days.
    Glad to know it's not just me! I keep trying to drink green tea, too - mainly because some here have said they saw reduced flushing and redness with it. But my rosacea keeps telling me to cut it out! Ah well. I pretty much just drink water now.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mistica View Post
    I don't have KPRF, so this thread isn't pertinent to me, however, I am a bad flusher and thought I would just add my experience with Ashwagandha.
    I tested it early last year
    as it is often recommended for those with hashimoto's, which I have.
    It made me flush like crazy to the point of facial explosion and I only took a low dose for two days. It took me 6 months to recover.
    I also react badly to most anaesthetics/sedatives as they are vasodilating.
    A few others here have reported the same issue.

    Coincidentally, I tried EGCG again yesterday after a negative reaction last year. Today I am redder than I have been in ages. It isn't a transient redder which dissipates after a time. This is here to stay for a long time, which really ticks me off.
    Hi Mistica .

    I kinda knew this would happen and now you after confirming it for me . thanks

    Fish Oil ,Green Tea used to make me flush badly also .

  4. #34
    Senior Member Mistica's Avatar
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    I asked my friendly scientist mentor, Prof Jaminet, if he would comment on the study linked in the first post.

    He has replied saying that 'it would appear that lipid deficiencies might be a factor in KP flushing. This applies to eczema as well'.

    ******************
    Compared to rosacea flushing where lipids might be sufficient or in excess, but they oxidize resulting in inflammation:

    In rosacea studies, it has been noted that there is faulty lipid signalling, but what that really means, I don't know. There is also a huge amount of oxidative stress.
    Member Drums/Drummond asserted that part of his cure of type two rosacea was by eliminating all fats barring olive oil.
    Personally, I react badly to supplemental oils and seeing it is now well known that omega oils, including fish oil oxidize quickly, this probably partially explains the reason. It is also vasodilatory. Some people appear to find benefit from them, but it would appear this would depend on the antioxidant status of the individual. The supplemental form can still do harm though. That includes flaxseed etc.

    I also react badly to some healthy dietary fats, including olive oil, coconut oil. I can tolerate small amounts of saturated fats, such as ghee used in cooking and fats in meats. I have had issues with fats for a long time and because Niacinamide (oral and topical) really tone things down for me, it is likely they are accomplishing this by A)inhibiting free fatty acid release and B) acting as an antioxidant C) supporting mitochondrial function.
    I have always found that if my face becomes oily, the inflammation and flushing increases. Niacinamide helps control this.

    Prof Jaminet's comments on this type of reaction was the following:

    'Excess oil causes oxidative stress and if you are antioxidant deficient thatís going to exacerbate the depletion of fragile lipids. Try a mixed tocotrienol supplement along with vitamin C, zinc, copper, N-acetylcysteine, taurine, glycine. Also eat plenty of egg yolks'. (for choline in particular).

    My experience with his suggestions are the following:
    I react badly to anything which has potent vasodilatory effects. The mixed tocotrienol seems like a good idea, but I was unable to find a low dose and the product I tried last year caused massive flushing which took months to settle down.

    NAC (N-acetylcysteine) is also a potent vasodilator. I took that when I did the CAP protocol for Cpn and again it caused flushing, BUT I have noted in a few other rosacean's, flushers who have tried it, that it does reduce symptoms, so perhaps I was just unlucky. NAC helps the body create glutathione, which is a powerful antioxidant. Zinc/copper also helps produce this. (See below).

    Many of the helpful supplements for health maladies have a vasodilatory component, which makes finding non harmful therapeutic strategies really difficult for flushers.

    Zinc and the Zinc/copper balance is crucial. Some members here swear by zinc. Driven springs to mind. He loves the stuff. I can't tolerate it at all and recently decided I'll try oysters as they are high in zinc. (I tested borderline low for zinc and mid range for copper).

    I have never taken Taurine. I love vitamin C in the forms of sodium ascorbate and ascorbic acid.

    Glycine.
    I make my own bone stock/broth and find the 'gelatin' helpful. It is calming. Too much makes me flush. Same with the gelatin for making jelly, which I believe Americans call jello. There is 21% glycine and 12% proline in gelatin. I've never tried the supplements. Glycine and proline in particular are crucial for tissue repair.
    Among other things, Glycine also helps regulate blood sugar, helps synthesize bile acids used in digestion of fats (helpful if KP is due to a deficiency of lipids. Taurine applies here as well), plays a role in the CNS and affects neurotransmitter levels.
    And it is the latter which makes me very cautious/reluctant to supplement with pills as these are usually high dose. It is rare to find a low dose supplement of anything these days and I find that excessive amounts of anything swing the pendulum from one extreme to another and only serve to cause adverse symptoms. Gelatin is balanced, as nature created, so munching on home made gelatin such as 'Great Lakes', would be a safer way to incorporate glycine and it's companion amino acids into the diet. At least as a starting point.

    http://www.vitaminstuff.com/amino-acid-glycine.html

    Glycine is lesser known antioxidant:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11939124

    I recall at least one poster on this forum who found glycine supplements helpful.


    Perhaps a worthwhile trial for those with KP might be to increase healthy fats, such as coconut oil, olive oil, ghee, but to ensure a good level of antioxidant status is achieved first.

    I'd check iodine levels too.
    Iodine is a powerful antioxidant and helps prevent lipid peroxidation. Lots of people are deficient and have no clue. Running spot urine tests aren't standard for most GP's.
    Prof Paul didn't include this in his comments, but it may have been an oversight as he has frequently discussed it with me on other occasions.

    Not sure if any of this is helpful, but I thought I would pass it on. Maybe something useful will come out of it.
    Last edited by Mistica; 21st February 2016 at 03:47 AM.
    Previous Numerous IPL.
    Supplements: Niacinamide, Vit K2, low D3, Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Very low dose B's. Low dose zinc (to correct deficiency).
    Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA.

    Treating for gut dysbiosis under specialist care. (This is helping).
    Previous GAPS diet. Testing tolerance of resistant starch.
    Fermented Foods. 2 to 3 days per week, Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Mistica's Avatar
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    Selenium has antioxidant actions too. It is also involved in lipid metabolism.
    Previous Numerous IPL.
    Supplements: Niacinamide, Vit K2, low D3, Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Very low dose B's. Low dose zinc (to correct deficiency).
    Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA.

    Treating for gut dysbiosis under specialist care. (This is helping).
    Previous GAPS diet. Testing tolerance of resistant starch.
    Fermented Foods. 2 to 3 days per week, Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.

  6. #36
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    I have KP and KPRF . I drinks a lot of olive oil and flaxseed oil also coco. I not noticed that it deteriorated state of the skin. On the contrary ...

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by poppe View Post
    I have KP and KPRF . I drinks a lot of olive oil and flaxseed oil also coco. I not noticed that it deteriorated state of the skin. On the contrary ...


    Hi Poppe

    She encourages people with KPRF to include Olive + Flax oil in their diets .

    And like yourself I also consume Olive and Flax oil every day .

  8. #38
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    Default Day 3 on ashwagandha

    Just keeping the thread updated as I said I would, taking 2 capsules in morning and 2 in afternoon, I can see alittle improvement already, not had one flush yet and redness is more tolerable, that's an honest updated, will see how things are by end of week don't want get my hopes up yet...

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xxcooperxx View Post
    Just keeping the thread updated as I said I would, taking 2 capsules in morning and 2 in afternoon, I can see alittle improvement already, not had one flush yet and redness is more tolerable, that's an honest updated, will see how things are by end of week don't want get my hopes up yet...
    Get your hopes up for what ? . You are living in fantasy land if you think anything good is going to come from this .

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by davekelly View Post
    Get your hopes up for what ? . You are living in fantasy land if you think anything good is going to come from this .

    I sware he's the most ignorant , negative and bitter person I've ever came across

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