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Thread: Seborrheic Dermatitis & Folliculitis -- Review of OTC Treatments for Malassezia

  1. #621
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Busby View Post
    Zinc pyrithione (ZP) doesn't dissolve in anything so you can't add it to a shampoo. You can add it of course, but don't expect much from a dump-in method. It will clump up either at the top or the bottom of the shampoo.

    You could probably try to suspend the ZP particles of ZP in a shampoo by mixing some pre-neutralized 0.05% sodium carbomer in water and glycerin (roughly 50/50), and then add ZP, and then dump it in a base shampoo, so the ZP is 2% of the base. This would be really bad aesthetically.

    But more importantly, ZP doesn't do anything useful as to seb derm, because it has no effect on malassezia. You can google all of the main manufacturer's research articles if you want to know more. Long story short, the manufacturer has several in-house chemists who tried to determine what ZP does, and have stated that it binds to copper on the skin and thereby works as a super-mild exfoliant. The manufacturer's last study, before they apparently gave up trying, found that it's functionality was similar to live brewer's yeast. (???) Really. I don't know why anyone buys a product with ZP.

    The manufacturer has a great advertising campaign, I'll give them that. ZP was first marketed as H&S in the 1960's (and is therefore grandfathered under the old rules, which don't require any proof of effectiveness), so the FDA allows them to claim it treats dandruff. Bad laws allow for useless products.
    Thanks for the tip, guess it isn't really practical then. ZP shampoo gave me a lot of relief, I bought Boot's store brand shampoo but they decided to completely change the whole recipe, remove Zinc add fragrance but make no mention of it.
    It makes sense that it has no effect on malassezia but gave me relief. Malassezia is part of everyone's natural skin biome, people with seb derm just cannot it a genetic defect, possibly related to a compromised epidermal barrier. Trying to battle Malassezia is futile and you're not getting at the root of the problem. The best we can do is to constantly clear the build-up from our scalp to provide temporary relief. Maybe the shampoo worked because it didn't contain irritating ingredients like fragrance and the Zinc made for an effective and gentle build-up remover.
    Last edited by applecake; 5th July 2019 at 10:38 AM.

  2. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Busby View Post
    All ketoconazole shampoos are made with sulfate-surfactants and you may be experiencing skin irritation and skin drying from the surfactants.

    Or, the dry skin may be an excess of keratin, which is a separate condition but probably creates a favorable environment for malassezia, initially. It's a chicken or egg kind of question, in my opinion.

    Either way, you'll be better off trying the shampoo daily for 2 weeks and then deciding whether you're getting positive results, overall.

    3-4 minutes is long enough to leave the lather on your skin. Be sure to rinse completely -- the sulfate surfactants must be washed off completely. The best way to ensure that you're rinsing completely is to wash off the shampoo in the shower. Splashing in the sink is not nearly as good for rinsing. And rinse about twice as long as you think is necessary, either in the shower or in the sink.

    Fluconazole didn't do anything for me.
    Hey Tom, are there any supplements you recommend taking for SD to help against the oilyness? Or food to avoid. I guess why Accutane helped is of course the vit A but my body cant handle Accutane no more, heat intolerance, dry lips etc.. Im taking Zinc, Omega 369, Magnesium (Orotat) at the moment but yet actually seeing improvement.
    Just wonder if you know something that helps in that regard.
    Thx

  3. #623
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    I bought the Eucerin shampoo today from Toms protocol that contains Climbazol and Pirocton Olamin. There are actually two versions of it the Gel for more yellow oily dandruff and the Creme for dry dandruff. At least thats how they describe it.
    Now that I not really suffer from much dandruff at all but really oily, sensitive/burning scalp with dry hair, hair loss I still went with the Gel verison as it contains less ingredients.
    After showering it b2b my hair feels not so dry as other shampoos do.
    Its actually for daily use. I guess I will use it for a week or two and see.
    Last edited by opare; 11th July 2019 at 07:20 PM.

  4. #624
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    Quote Originally Posted by opare View Post
    I bought the Eucerin shampoo today from Toms protocol that contains Climbazol and Pirocton Olamin. There are actually two versions of it the Gel for more yellow oily dandruff and the Creme for dry dandruff. At least thats how they describe it.
    Now that I not really suffer from much dandruff at all but really oily, sensitive/burning scalp with dry hair, hair loss I still went with the Gel verison as it contains less ingredients.
    After showering it b2b my hair feels not so dry as other shampoos do.
    Its actually for daily use. I guess I will use it for a week or two and see.
    Let us know how you get on .
    Iíve been using ELVIVE PHYTOCLEAR SHAMP SENSITIVE 400ML

    Ingredients : Aqua / Water, Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Coco-Betaine, Glycol Distearate, Glycerin, Ci 42090 / Blue 1, Ci 14700 / Red 4, Ci 19140 / Yellow 5, Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride, Sodium Chloride, Sodium Benzoate, Sodium Hydroxide, Ppg-5-Ceteth-20, Peg-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Salicylic Acid, Melaleuca Alternifolia Leaf Oil / Tea Tree Leaf Oil, Limonene, Fumaric Acid, Cymbopogon Schoenanthus Oil, Menthol, Linalool, Propylene Glycol, Piroctone Olamine, Carbomer, Geraniol, Octyldodecanol, Citronellol, Citrus Aurantium Bergamia Peel Oil / Bergamot Peel Oil, Citric Acid, Lavandula Angustifolia Oil / Lavender Oil, Hexyl Cinnamal, Parfum / Fragrance
    My skin can tolerate this and it has Piroctone Olamine in . But they have just changed the formula and now it irritates my skin.

  5. #625
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubydo1 View Post
    Let us know how you get on .
    I’ve been using ELVIVE PHYTOCLEAR SHAMP SENSITIVE 400ML

    Ingredients : Aqua / Water, Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Coco-Betaine, Glycol Distearate, Glycerin, Ci 42090 / Blue 1, Ci 14700 / Red 4, Ci 19140 / Yellow 5, Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride, Sodium Chloride, Sodium Benzoate, Sodium Hydroxide, Ppg-5-Ceteth-20, Peg-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Salicylic Acid, Melaleuca Alternifolia Leaf Oil / Tea Tree Leaf Oil, Limonene, Fumaric Acid, Cymbopogon Schoenanthus Oil, Menthol, Linalool, Propylene Glycol, Piroctone Olamine, Carbomer, Geraniol, Octyldodecanol, Citronellol, Citrus Aurantium Bergamia Peel Oil / Bergamot Peel Oil, Citric Acid, Lavandula Angustifolia Oil / Lavender Oil, Hexyl Cinnamal, Parfum / Fragrance
    My skin can tolerate this and it has Piroctone Olamine in . But they have just changed the formula and now it irritates my skin.
    Is that the new formula? Ive run a lot of products through SkinCarisma lately to check ingredients and this doesnt look that good tbf. If it irritates you this site may help you in finding something new. There was a Malassezia site linked here before to someone that listed up lots of products and his experience. Very helpful if you are stuck

  6. #626
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    Quote Originally Posted by opare View Post
    I bought the Eucerin shampoo today from Toms protocol that contains Climbazol and Pirocton Olamin. There are actually two versions of it the Gel for more yellow oily dandruff and the Creme for dry dandruff. At least thats how they describe it.
    Now that I not really suffer from much dandruff at all but really oily, sensitive/burning scalp with dry hair, hair loss I still went with the Gel verison as it contains less ingredients.
    After showering it b2b my hair feels not so dry as other shampoos do.
    Its actually for daily use. I guess I will use it for a week or two and see.
    Quick update on this, it didnt last long as my burning sensation on my scalp got worse, maybe thats normal in the beginning, after visiting new derm, he gave me Ektoselen Shampoo with sulfur and selenium disulphide. not sure if translation works. Mixed feelings so far and havent read that great things about it online. 3xWeek. After two washes, hair still very dry and scalp hot, itchy and sensitive. No dandruff.

  7. #627
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Busby View Post
    Hi aussiechick, I tried Mustella Foam very early in my attempts to treat SD with climbazole, and found it to be completely ineffective. I believe that the climbazole in it isn't dissolved and emulsified.

    Later, I figured out how to dissolve climbazole in alcohol (which can be isopropanol or ethanol) and then emulsify it into an oil-in-water lotion and shampoo. Only in this way, I found that climbazole was very effective -- this is the foundation for my best guess as to why Mustella is worthless. It also illustrates that we can't just dump climbazole into something and expect it to work.

    And spiritus asked my current opinion as to the chicken or egg, in other words, which comes first, an allergy to malassezia or what? Good question.

    After testing one ingredient after another, in individual succession, to isolate the "first cause," it seems in my case that an excess of keratin created an environment where the fungus malassezia could thrive. My opinion is based on my subsequent use of Vitamin A, a super mild retinol, and sodium hyaluronate, HMW, both of which slowly dissolve the excess keratin layer. Sure, climbazole will nuke the fungal load, but the excess keratin layer requires more time and effort, and requires the ingredients I mentioned above. It has become apparent in my case that it should have been most important to remove the excess keratin layer. Well, live and learn.

    With hindsight, I can now see what I had been battling. Not only an allergic reaction to malassezia, but to everything else that goes wrong from having a sticky layer of excess keratin. For example, the awful windblown glochids from prickly pear, cholla, and other desert cacti that can became embedded in excess keratin. Look up glochids and you can see how they get embedded -- I think malassezia works in a similar way.
    Hi Tom,

    Iím just pondering after further failed treatments - I was wondering what you used for the sodium hyaluronate product you used to assist with the extra keratin layer? Assuming you may have made your own concoction being the clever person you are. For those of us who are less clever(!), are there any specific products you could recommend?

    Thanks a lot,

    Jess

  8. #628
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    Hello everybody and hello Tom, I would like to know what's the best topic for seb derm and Malassezia
    Is it soolantra or is it rozex in cream?
    I mean to put on the little red areas or red dot point on forehead or near the hair line?
    My condition seems to be worst especially in summer when we have high temperature or very high humidity in July or August, when we have very high temperature.
    Thks for your reply

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