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Thread: Low level light therapy vs red light therapy for edema/swelling

  1. #1
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    Default Low level light therapy vs red light therapy for edema/swelling

    Hi guys, what do you think would be better for rosacea swelling/edema, Low level light therapy or red light therapy? Use to come and go but has now slowly got to a point where its permanent (winter in the uk, im sure it makes me swell 10x worse?).

    Or is there anything else you have used to control edema, supplements, meds, lasers etc?

    Was recently prescribed clonidine (1st thing ive tried to control flushes). Will let you all know how i get on!

    Thanks alot.

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    Any input is welcome.

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    Senior Member IowaDavid's Avatar
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    RLT is a subgroup of LLLT. RLT is visible red light at low-level light intensity levels. "LLLT" can be any wavelength of light--blue, invisible infrared (heat), yellow, green, etc.

    I've found that RLT can help with that "puffy face" that occurs from too much standing inflammation, and can be helpful if you have an attack of it.

    There are other forms of LLLT which are at higher energy levels and tend to be infrared light that are designed to treat inflammation in acute wounds. The problem for us is that form of LLLT is kind of a gamble and depends on how your body responds. I don't know enough about that use of LLLT to comment personally, and only understand it from what I've read.

    Hope this helps. Feel free to PM me if you'd like.

    Best,

    David
    35 year-old male
    Erythmatotelangiectatic rosacea & Ocular
    20 + laser treatments.
    Toleraine Soothing Light Facial Fluid for moisturizer. I don't use a special cleanser. Clonidine daily; klonopin sometimes.
    BEST and CURRENT TREATMENT I use: Low-Level Red Light Therapy LED array.
    Please feel free to PM me with your low-level red light therapy (LLRLT) questions. I'm happy to help if I can.

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    I found propranolol helpful for swelling or edema. After being on it a few days, my cheeks looked a lot smaller. It's possible that clonidine will have the same effect if the swelling is vascular in nature, since clonidine constricts the peripheral vasculature.

    I also found curcumin (turmeric extract) to be helpful. After taking it for a while, my nose looked smaller and less red. Bioavailability of curcumin is poor, so it's unlikely that just taking turmeric pills (as opposed to the extract) or making your own pills from turmeric powder will be helpful. There are a couple techniques for improving bioavailability of curcumin extract: one is combining it with bioperine (a black pepper extract) and the other is a proprietary formulation called Meriva that combines curcumin with soy lecithin. The effects of curcumin are similar to those of NSAIDs, so it might be worth trying something cheaper like aspirin or ibuprofen first. However, NSAIDs (and possibly curcumin -- I wouldn't know) can counteract at least some effects of clonidine.

    I have no medical or scientific training and this is not medical advice, so please use your judgement accordingly.

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    Hey guys, really appreciate you taking the time to reply! Will try and do some more research on RLT before going down that route.

    Propranolol idea sounds great! Only thing that would worry me is sexual side effects.

    Have heard about curcumin along with others such as quercetin and bromelain, was looking for a potent brand a few weeks back but with xmas coming up i ended up not buying it!

    Had my 1st dose of clonidine this evening at 50mcg..seemed to have no effect what so ever. Will try again in the morning with regular use. Out of curiosity has anyone else had to up the dose and have success with clonidine?

    Once again i appreciate your replies, thanks alot.

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    Senior Member IowaDavid's Avatar
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    You can up your clonidine to .1 mg 3 times per day, if your doctor says it's all right. I've used more than that in one day before. I think the clonidine pills actually go up to .3 mg, if I remember, so you have that to keep in mind.

    What's your flushing like? Or are you red and swollen without a lot of flushing? Do you have acne-like lesions?


    Best,

    David
    35 year-old male
    Erythmatotelangiectatic rosacea & Ocular
    20 + laser treatments.
    Toleraine Soothing Light Facial Fluid for moisturizer. I don't use a special cleanser. Clonidine daily; klonopin sometimes.
    BEST and CURRENT TREATMENT I use: Low-Level Red Light Therapy LED array.
    Please feel free to PM me with your low-level red light therapy (LLRLT) questions. I'm happy to help if I can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IowaDavid View Post
    You can up your clonidine to .1 mg 3 times per day, if your doctor says it's all right. I've used more than that in one day before. I think the clonidine pills actually go up to .3 mg, if I remember, so you have that to keep in mind.

    What's your flushing like? Or are you red and swollen without a lot of flushing? Do you have acne-like lesions?


    Best,

    David


    Oh really? Thats good news..will up my dose to 0.75mcg x 3 tomorrow and see how i get on.

    My flushing is triggered by the ussual triggers such as heat, alcohol, warm room flush, exercise. But i also find my face swells and burns during each flush also. The swelling and burning are by far the worst symptoms and makes it hard to just 'forget about it'. My face does have times where it looks normal with no redness but i always have a mild form of swelling in my cheeks.
    I have no P&Ps, only your standard mild teenage acne.

    Thanks, phil

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    Senior Member IowaDavid's Avatar
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    So you feel pressure in your face and burning when a flush comes on...then the redness may leave, but you're left with a feeling of pressure or your face looks/feels puffy for minutes/hours after a flushing episode?

    Do you notice the swelling in your face is more prevalent or "not unusual" in the afternoons and evenings after it's been stressed throughout the day, even though it may not look red to someone else?

    Best,

    David
    35 year-old male
    Erythmatotelangiectatic rosacea & Ocular
    20 + laser treatments.
    Toleraine Soothing Light Facial Fluid for moisturizer. I don't use a special cleanser. Clonidine daily; klonopin sometimes.
    BEST and CURRENT TREATMENT I use: Low-Level Red Light Therapy LED array.
    Please feel free to PM me with your low-level red light therapy (LLRLT) questions. I'm happy to help if I can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IowaDavid View Post
    So you feel pressure in your face and burning when a flush comes on...then the redness may leave, but you're left with a feeling of pressure or your face looks/feels puffy for minutes/hours after a flushing episode?

    Do you notice the swelling in your face is more prevalent or "not unusual" in the afternoons and evenings after it's been stressed throughout the day, even though it may not look red to someone else?

    Best,

    David
    Yes and yes! Hit the nail on the head with both of them. Alot of the time i look in the mirror and im not even that red! Just burning and swelling.. A few months back i remember the swelling use to actually completely go by around 9pm. I have now made my own conclusion that the lymphatic system is now to damaged to remove the swelling. That or its the winter here in the uk and my face is constantly swollen in the cold!

    To add to my last post, i dont know how but i managed to miss my main trigger SOCIAL BLUSHING!

    Thanks for your help!
    Phil

  10. #10
    Senior Member IowaDavid's Avatar
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    I've had extremely similar symptoms in the past--that's why I wanted to describe them as best I could. lol.

    Yeah, that stuff sucks. Big time. I already have a rounded kind of face, so you get swelling there, too, and you look just weird...not fun. And the pain and skin sensitivity is super annoying.

    Honestly, man, I think the you'd really benefit from trying RLT. Probably changing your diet to a more paleo anti-inflammatory nutrition-intensive one, if you haven't already. (This is not an overnight "switch" you make. It takes several months to get accustomed to it and take new steps. Don't feel bad if you go slow and just don't get overwhelmed by it.)

    Best,

    David
    35 year-old male
    Erythmatotelangiectatic rosacea & Ocular
    20 + laser treatments.
    Toleraine Soothing Light Facial Fluid for moisturizer. I don't use a special cleanser. Clonidine daily; klonopin sometimes.
    BEST and CURRENT TREATMENT I use: Low-Level Red Light Therapy LED array.
    Please feel free to PM me with your low-level red light therapy (LLRLT) questions. I'm happy to help if I can.

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