Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 41

Thread: LED Light Therapy Research

  1. #11
    Senior Member Peter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,085

    Default

    Cough cough tap tap

    Come on you two LLL'ers - pack it in

    TP

    That was a very good and informative article which I would like to forward onto Tony Chu?
    Probably one of the best I have seen yet and with plenty of links.

    Interesting comments about eye safety.

    Thanks

    Peter

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    304

    Default

    Hi TP,

    very interesting and good article, thanks! I have a question though: I wonder: if RLT has a proven effect on woundhealing (quicker), then that would mean that it improves bloodsupply to the damaged tissue, as far as I understand. I can see why red light helps to prevent inflammation, but this improved bloodsupply would be not so good for vascular rosacea I would think.. can you enlighten me here perhaps?

    Thanks < natalja

  3. #13
    Senior Member Twickle Purple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Hi Natalja,

    That has been a conundrum, one which reflects the lack of understanding of all the processes involved.

    A bit from this post here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Guest
    I don't normally post over here, but I wanted to answer your question about NO level as it is a really good one. I put together the RLT info per a bunch of recent posts here and on the RSG about a potential mechanism of action for rosacea.

    First of all, please understand that I have no medical background whatsoever. I've just done some googling on inflammation and try to stick to studies that seem to have some scientific merit. That said, here's my take on this:

    Nitric oxide's role in inflammation is fairly complex and I'm not sure it is yet completely understood (or widely agreed upon). Still, some studies seem to suggest that most of the damage attributed to nitric oxide is actually caused by peroxynitrite, a powerful oxidant which is formed when nitric oxide combines with superoxide :

    http://www.biochemsoctrans.org/bst/0...31394.htm#SCH1
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract


    Apparently superoxide dismutase and nitric oxide compete with each other to combine with nitric oxide:

    http://bmc.ub.uni-potsdam.de/1476-5926-2-2/F1.htm

    So potentially (and I'm theorizing here), as RLT increases levels of superoxide dismutase (SOD), the SOD combines with much of the superoxide radicals, letting NO levels temporarily increase (since they can't combine with the superoxide to form peroxynitrte anymore) until the TNF-a decreasing effects also kick in and NO induction is also reduced.

    I'm wondering if this might explain some of the temporary increases in flushing some have mentioned as well (since they nitric oxide levels do seem to increase at least temporarily).

    Anyway, hope this helps. It's certainly not definitive, and I'm certainly no expert, but it may help to explain how RLT seems to help some rosaceans.

    Take care,
    Dan (aka dfries2003)
    From the 1st sited link:
    Nitric oxide (NO) can induce cell death; however, NO-induced cell death may be dependent/conditional on factors other than NO itself. Whether NO kills a particular cell depends on the amount of NO, source of NO, time of exposure to NO, cell type and the levels of other factors including, particularly oxygen, superoxide, H2O2, antioxidants, thiols and glycolysis.
    From the 2nd sited link:
    In the last decade it has become well established that in the skin, nitric oxide (NO), a diffusable gas, mediates various physiologic functions ranging from the regulation of cutaneous blood flow to melanogenesis. If produced in excess, NO combines with superoxide anion to form peroxynitrite (ONOO-), a cytotoxic oxidant that has been made responsible for tissue injury during shock, inflammation and ischemia-reperfusion. The opposite effects of NO and ONOO- on various cellular processes may explain the 'double-edged sword' nature of NO depending on whether or not cellular conditions favour peroxynitrite formation. Peroxynitrite has been shown to activate the nuclear nick sensor enzyme, poly(ADP-ribose) polymerase (PARP). Overactivation of PARP depletes the cellular stores of NAD+, the substrate of PARP, and the ensuing 'cellular energetic catastrophy' results in necrotic cell death. Whereas the role of NO in numerous skin diseases including wound healing, burn injury, psoriasis, irritant and allergic contact dermatitis, ultraviolet (UV) light-induced sunburn erythema and the control of skin infections has been extensively documented, the intracutaneous role of peroxynitrite and PARP has not been fully explored. We have recently demonstrated peroxynitrite production, DNA breakage and PARP activation in a murine model of contact hypersensitivity, and propose that the peroxynitrite-PARP route represents a common pathway in the pathomechanism of inflammatory skin diseases.
    From the 3rd sited link:
    Superoxide is able to react with NO to form reactive nitrogen species, which could not have vasodilatory effects. Superoxide dismutase competes with NO to react with superoxide. Superoxide dismutase activity leads to breakdown of superoxide and may be regarded as a "NO sparing enzyme". Glutathione and NO may lead to possible storage of NO-derivatives.
    I think that Dan's comment "Apparently superoxide dismutase and nitric oxide compete with each other to combine with nitric oxide" may have meant "Superoxide dismutase competes with NO to react with superoxide. "

    Happiness is a choice.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Twickle Purple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    My interests have veered mostly into the area of LED therapy now, so I've decided to create a site dedicated to it, with the hope that it will reach more people. I've secured domains and am just working on the format and presentation. Work is pretty hectic right now, so it will take longer than I'd like at the rate I'm going. If anyone finds any more info they would like included there please let me know. LED therapy has the possibility of helping so many people.

    PS. There will be NO advertisements or Sponsors. It will be just a continuation of what I have done to-date here. My doctor had asked that I put info together for her patients, as well my neighbours are getting interested so I thought it best to prepare an LED therapy dedicated site.

    PSS. Anyone interested in looking into this a bit more here do a search in the archives for Banshee, Tioh2001, Jen, IowaDavid and Peter. Their posts were instrumental in my trying LED therapy.

    Happiness is a choice.

  5. #15
    Senior Member fut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    613

    Default

    I'd liek to note I have seen increased benefits when switching to an adapter with a stronger output. Sometimes that's all it takes to make a difference!

    Has anyone seen any increased benefits from switching from Red to Red and near Infrared?

  6. #16
    Senior Member Twickle Purple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fut
    I'd liek to note I have seen increased benefits when switching to an adapter with a stronger output. Sometimes that's all it takes to make a difference!

    Has anyone seen any increased benefits from switching from Red to Red and near Infrared?
    There was a difference when I switched. Because the NIR goes deeper, going in stages was the way for me to go.

    Happiness is a choice.

  7. #17
    Senior Member fut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    613

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Twickle Purple
    There was a difference when I switched. Because the NIR goes deeper, going in stages was the way for me to go.
    Thanks for the response. Can you elaborate? What kind of difference did you see when you switched? What do mean you mean whn you say "going in stages?"

  8. #18
    Senior Member Twickle Purple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Hi Fut,

    I used 660nm for a couple of months. This worked very well. The improvement I was seeing accelerated noticably when I moved added the NIR. However, I believe that beginning with 660nm only was the way to go for my skin. I hope the following explains that a bit:

    Think of a cross section of skin, different depths contain different components (and they are discovering more players all the time). The Yellow light does not penetrate deeply and stimulates action on the more superficial levels (which is why it works on my eyelids and lymph), red goes deeper and NIR goes deeper yet. All 3 depths of skin tissue have different 'occupants' (for lack of a better word), the different wavelengths work with the 'inhabitants' of those levels. This explains why the NIR also works on my facial nerve pain, but lower wavelengths do not and why the red or NIR did not effect my eyelids as readily as the yellow. Healing through the 'layers' is how I see it. I had a lot of damage to the top layers of my skin, the mix of 660/880 would have helped definitely but going with straight 660 at the beginning was more focussed. I was healing up very well and then added in the 880 to the 660 to go deeper yet. Some folks may never see the need to add the NIR.

    I've got lots of stuff that you'll be able to sift through once the site is up, most that doesn't specifically pertain to what we are dealing with here, but speaks to the efficacy of LLLT in general. But, I've hired the build out so it's not happening on my timetable...

    Happiness is a choice.

  9. #19
    Senior Member fut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    613

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Twickle Purple
    Hi Fut,
    I used 660nm for a couple of months. This worked very well. The improvement I was seeing accelerated noticably when I moved added the NIR. However, I believe that beginning with 660nm only was the way to go for my skin.
    That's great news!


    Quote Originally Posted by Twickle Purple
    Think of a cross section of skin, different depths contain different components (and they are discovering more players all the time). The Yellow light does not penetrate deeply and stimulates action on the more superficial levels (which is why it works on my eyelids and lymph), red goes deeper and NIR goes deeper yet. All 3 depths of skin tissue have different 'occupants' (for lack of a better word), the different wavelengths work with the 'inhabitants' of those levels. This explains why the NIR also works on my facial nerve pain, but lower wavelengths do not and why the red or NIR did not effect my eyelids as readily as the yellow. Healing through the 'layers' is how I see it. I had a lot of damage to the top layers of my skin, the mix of 660/880 would have helped definitely but going with straight 660 at the beginning was more focussed. I was healing up very well and then added in the 880 to the 660 to go deeper yet. Some folks may never see the need to add the NIR.
    That explains a lot. Confirms a couple of things that I've been thinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twickle Purple
    I've got lots of stuff that you'll be able to sift through once the site is up, most that doesn't specifically pertain to what we are dealing with here, but speaks to the efficacy of LLLT in general. But, I've hired the build out so it's not happening on my timetable...
    Good to hear. I look forward to the site!

    Withy our recommendation I will go ahead and purchase an 880nm infrared array from Elixa. Before I do so, I just want to clear one thing up. You state that the 850nm is more readily absorbed. Any idea where to purchase an 850nm array instead of 880nm?

    Thanks,
    Fut

  10. #20
    Senior Member Twickle Purple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Hi Fut,

    That was from a quoted article. You can request any wavelength LED you want when you have an array made up. Different wavelengths may cost out higher (e.g., my 595nm array was more than my 660nm one). Ask Elixa (or Ledman) for costing on the 850 if you want to go that route. I use the 880nm LEDs. I'm happy with them.

    hth,
    TP

    Happiness is a choice.

Similar Threads

  1. Low level light therapy vs red light therapy for edema/swelling
    By philmitchel in forum Low level light based therapies
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 26th December 2012, 05:34 PM
  2. Photodynamic Therapy (Blue light therapy w/ Levulan?)
    By maude in forum Low level light based therapies
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11th May 2012, 02:59 AM
  3. **POLL** Low Level Light Therapy / Red Light Therapy
    By Twickle Purple in forum Low level light based therapies
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 22nd December 2010, 10:13 AM
  4. Treat Rosacea: New Research Sheds Light on Possible Role of Vitamin D
    By mrsmoof in forum News, research articles and current affairs
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 12th November 2010, 08:37 AM
  5. the new dpl therapy light
    By shamrock in forum Low level light based therapies
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 22nd August 2007, 06:03 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •