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How I cured my rosacea

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  • #16
    Your post dismissed probiotics out of hand. I disagreed with that.

    Happiness is a choice.

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    • #17
      Hi TP,
      I do dismiss them out-of-hand, just as I dismiss every OTC diet remedy and OTC herbal (just about ANY OTC). Until sufficient study is done and evaluated by qualified experts (e.g. FDA), then the risks of recommending, say, Ginko biloba, is simply not worth either the potential health risks or money spent.
      Thats the great thing about our (USA) FDA, its slow, but thorough.
      The real enemy here, as I've come to learn, are all the companies selling this junk. Simply to make money (the particular company wanting me to sell their probiotic product (which incedentally contained no live cultures) and had fabulous claims with charts and graphs and using the same studies you posted, claimed that their "nutrients" supported growth of enteric bacteria and eliminated yeast infections. Even if the tablets (note 'tablets') contained live culture...how to you go from the colon to the vagina??? Irritates me when I think about it -- just out to make money off folks who know no better (maybe this is the reason for my rant tonight). No more, I promise. If you do happen to come across anything interesting, I'd be grateful to hear it (either public or PM).
      Thanks for the interesting discussion.
      Perry
      p.

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      • #18
        Hi Lindsay

        All of what you are trying at the moment makes sense to me and I can understand how it would help to improve your Rosacea symptoms.

        I too suffered from the dreaded yeasty beasty when I took antibiotics. Whilst main stream may not give much credence to yeast overgrowth, I do believe there is enough out there to take the issue into serious consideration.

        Wishing you continued clearance and please do keep us posted on your progress.

        Jen
        Currently trying: Apr 06 Bee Wilder's Candida (natural healing) Diet; May 06 Home made red LED array; Aug 06 ZZ ointment.

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        • #19
          //

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          • #20
            Sorry for interfering this thread but I'm just curious what the potential health risks of Ginko biloba are..

            I was advised to use it a few years ago. I never did though..

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Twickle Purple
              Your post dismissed probiotics out of hand. I disagreed with that.
              TP

              I'm about to disagree as well. Have you seen that glamour girl who has suddenly appeared in your avatar? :P

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              • #22
                Originally posted by prryjones
                Hi TP,
                I do dismiss them out-of-hand, just as I dismiss every OTC diet remedy and OTC herbal (just about ANY OTC). Until sufficient study is done and evaluated by qualified experts (e.g. FDA), then the risks of recommending, say, Ginko biloba, is simply not worth either the potential health risks or money spent.
                Thats the great thing about our (USA) FDA, its slow, but thorough.
                The real enemy here, as I've come to learn, are all the companies selling this junk. Simply to make money (the particular company wanting me to sell their probiotic product (which incedentally contained no live cultures) and had fabulous claims with charts and graphs and using the same studies you posted, claimed that their "nutrients" supported growth of enteric bacteria and eliminated yeast infections. Even if the tablets (note 'tablets') contained live culture...how to you go from the colon to the vagina??? Irritates me when I think about it -- just out to make money off folks who know no better (maybe this is the reason for my rant tonight). No more, I promise. If you do happen to come across anything interesting, I'd be grateful to hear it (either public or PM).
                Thanks for the interesting discussion.
                Perry
                p.
                Hello Perry

                I agree there is a lot of junk out there and unscrupulous people prepared to rip you off but I don't think you can just dismiss everything OTC in one fail swoop as you are doing.

                As far as probiotics go I found them very useful but I did my research first and used a high quality one, albeit expensive for several months to help my gut after the systemic use of various antibiotics had made me feel very unwell. For me the product I used made all the difference but no doubt there are other brands out there which are substandard and do not meet the claims made. I feel probiotics have a part to play in our health and I still take one combined in a multivitamin tablet plus I also eat a high quality bio yoghurt daily and I feel all the better for doing so.

                One could argue Aloe Vera gel is an OTC herbal but for me as a topical it made a huge difference in my battle with rosacea and I would fully recommend it to other sufferers to try. Again there are probably Aloe Vera products out there which are not to the required quality but it's up to the individual to do their homework first and find out which are best.

                Unfortunately science and the so called experts cannot always prove everything. With rosacea anyway, my slant has always been if you find something that works and there are no apparent side effects then stick with it.

                Thanks

                Peter

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                • #23
                  Hello again,
                  I guess I am simply not clear in the point I'm trying to make.
                  As succintly as I can put it, the rule is: Unless a medicinal product has been shown to be both safe and efficacious in both clinical trials and in clinical practice, a pharmacist (.e.g. me) neither recommends it nor purports its use. Physicians work the same way.
                  I think that we (incl. me at times) are hypocritical concerning those things we expect from our "experts". Think about it. You take probiotics, without any cumulative evidence that they work. But, it works for you, so you maintain it works. How do you know the PBs were the cause for the improvement? My point is that the argument of "since they worked for me, they must work", is vastly inferior to the standard method of scientific research which dictates that: "Well, I took probioitics, and my symptoms improved. Hence probiotic use MIGHT have been at least partly responsible for my improvement. Thus, more studies (e.g. RTC's) are needed (good studies) before proper evaluation by 'experts' and final conclusion on their worth regarding any particular use." This is the scientific method and it's worked quite well for mankind so far.
                  This is how the system works and this is very correct and proper.
                  A similiar example occured recently in that a quite intelligent member here chose to experiment with melanotan. Well...it worked in his case, and certainly worked in mine. But, does that mean that I can tell folks, "Gee...it worked for me, thus it will certainly work for you and also, by the way, it's both safe and efficacious to use." ?
                  And then it's reported by some idiot doing clinical trials that hyperpigmentation of the retina (or something like that) has been observed. It took a clinical trial to bring this possible adverse effect to light.
                  I am finished arguing about this. I am not recommending them bc I don't know they work and the scientific community doesn't know they work and hence doesn't recommend their use and so I am going to save some money for the next person that asks me to comment about them.
                  Concerning the Ginko question..there have been conflicting studies (as with most OTC's). Also an important side effect with Ginko is that it thins the blood (decreases clotting factors). Thus, if one has a GI bleed (ulcer) or is taking other blood-thinning medications (e.g. warfarin), or has surgery while on the stuff...well, not a very good prognosis. This is but one example of why one has to be very careful (and knowlegeable) before recommending these unproven products.
                  On to college football.
                  Perry
                  p.s. Again, I simply not going to argue about this anymore, bc this is not the best medium to debate these things, but I would like to point out one final example by that dastardly gentleman which many here both cherish and adore -- Geoff Nase (I hate to mention his name bc ya'll have been doing so good lately and I certainly don't want to start another month-long bashing session). Anyway, he use to tout grapeseed-extract use, and before I became knowlegeable on the stuff...I spent hundreds of dollars on it. Well...does it work? Who knows? In theory maybe, but no clinical trials have been done regarding it's use and rosacea, so again, who knows? I know MY rosacea didn't get better (and even if it DID get better while I was taking the stuff, how can I claim that it was due to grapeseed)? Only RTCs will discover the (probable) truth.
                  Perry

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                  • #24
                    Hi Perry

                    I don't see an argument going on but wanted to place a post so that you couldn't ' // ' another of your posts. Word is a great programme to type out your thoughts before posting!

                    I hope you are feeling ok cos you seem kind of angry right now.

                    I'll reply in full in another post cos it's getting late here now.

                    Jen
                    Currently trying: Apr 06 Bee Wilder's Candida (natural healing) Diet; May 06 Home made red LED array; Aug 06 ZZ ointment.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      UPDATE :

                      I have had red ears for as long as I can remember, but I thought that was because I got frost bite there as a child, I didn't think it was due to my rosacea. However, now my ears are no longer red !!!! They look normal. And I haven't been using tea tree oil there either, so it must be the HCl supplements.

                      Man I'm so damn happy with this treatment.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Thanks for the up-date Lindsay.

                        It's always great to hear of things going well.

                        Jen
                        Currently trying: Apr 06 Bee Wilder's Candida (natural healing) Diet; May 06 Home made red LED array; Aug 06 ZZ ointment.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Perry

                          Obviously as a pharmarcist you are fully signed up the the scientific model of health-that science can evaluate and place judgement on everything out there as long as it has undergone the gold standard of the radomised controlled trials. It is the objective outcome that is given merit and the subjective experience that is almost holey dismissed.

                          But their are other viewpoints and opinions that in this postmodernist age that are equally as valid. I work in public health and have over the last few years been working my way through an open university degree that studies the positives/negatives of both the medical model of health and the social model of health.

                          The social model of health looks beyond that that scientifically proven and understands that peoples experiences are just as valid as RCT. Science has long tried to assert its point of view as the one truth but nowdays people are looking for alternatives after being badly let down by medicine that relies on drugs that offer little true help and as many side effects are benefits.

                          As you are opposed to the profiting from these OTC companies how about the massive pharmacuelitcals companies that make millions/billions every year and carry out some extremly dodgy practices.

                          Im not arguing with you just putting forward and alternative viewpoint as I haven't thought about my course much since last summer and wanted to see how much I can remember (not very much actualy).

                          ps in my area of work we will be carrying out sampling of probiotics drinks as it is suspected that they may contain not only 'good' bacteria but also potenially food poisoning ones aswell

                          Sarah

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                          • #28
                            Continuation of Update:

                            For a while I had been taking pancreatic enzyme supplements along with the HCl, and this has proven to be a mistake. My stomach swelled up a couple days ago, and although I was in no pain, I was alarmed so I phoned the government nurse health line.

                            She told me that it could be the pancreatic enzyme supplements, that my pancreas was probably working fine and that I have no need to take those, they could cause irritation. So I stopped taking them, and the swelling went away.

                            So I just wanted to warn anyone who might be thinking of trying my treatment, taking enzymes along with the HCl could be a bad idea. I no longer take the HCl with Pepsin enzyme supplements either, I've switched to an HCl supplement that has no enzymes.

                            I am learning through trial and error, but I am very happy with my treatment. Today is the 11th day I've been off the antibiotic, and my rosacea is gone.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Hi Lindsay

                              You might like to check out this Yahoo group:

                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/candidasupport/

                              When you join the group, you will be sent some intro files via e-mail. Very interesting reading and well worth the read.

                              Hope this helps.

                              Jen
                              Currently trying: Apr 06 Bee Wilder's Candida (natural healing) Diet; May 06 Home made red LED array; Aug 06 ZZ ointment.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Sincere aplogies to Jen

                                Jen,
                                My sincere apology for my rudeness to you. I totally misread your post and conjured up some sort of tit-for-tat game that existed only in my head.
                                I appreciate your graciousness and though one should never justify rudenss, I say only that I am extremely agitated at present and will try not to post again until I get my butt off my shoulders.
                                I hope you accept my apology.
                                Sincerely,
                                Perry

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