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Research suggests rosacea subtypes may be different conditions

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  • Research suggests rosacea subtypes may be different conditions

    A new article published in Dermatology Times worth reading:


  • #2
    This reinforces something I've thought for a long time - rosacea is a "catch-all" term for a condition manifested by a red face for which no aetiology can be found.

    The so-called "sub-types" are, in my view, completely different medical conditions which explains why a closer examination of the red face reveals different characteristics and multiple causes for the ruddiness. It also explains why the success of therapy is so unpredictable.

    Comment


    • #3
      This is one of my favorite quotes:

      "Rosacea is probably a collection of many different diseases that are lumped together inappropriately." Zoe Diana Draelos, MD - January 25, 2007.

      This has been on the RRDi home page for several years now.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Brady Barrows View Post
        "Rosacea is probably a collection of many different diseases that are lumped together inappropriately." Zoe Diana Draelos, MD - January 25, 2007.
        My view entirely. It explains why there is no single successful treatment - nor can there ever be.

        My own rosacea is phymatous with telangiectasia and a suffuse butterfly flush. I have no papulopustular symptoms whatever. The phyma is a fairly recent development, the telangiectasia has been present for about 15 years and the flush most of the time in my memory. I also have seborrhoeic dermatitis of my scalp, hairline and ears (front and behind). I cannot believe that these are all presentations of the same condition.

        Comment


        • #5
          Completely agree with the consensus in this thread.

          Comment


          • #6
            When I was first officially diagnosed in mid 2000, the derm said to me "you do have rosacea, but I am not sure it is only rosacea".
            My history, the way it presented, the other health issues I had at the time and had in the past, were all signs that something else was probably going on. He freely admitted he didn't know what it was and ordered numerous tests. They came out negative, but even so, he still maintained something else was hiding behind the red face, but it could take years to find out what it was.

            He was right.

            What has always puzzled me is how so many (other) doctors in general, can be so dumb.
            Sounds insulting? Well, I can understand that, but consider this.

            If a drug used for a certain type of facial rash (or other health problem) provides some benefits, but has no effect, or worsens others, shouldn't that tell them that the diagnosis is incorrect?
            Why continue to hand out the same drug simply as the manual tells them to do so?

            This scenario always reminds me of a Paddington Bear Story I read as a young child.
            Paddington was told to watch the toast.
            He did just that. Watched it burn to a crisp. No one told him to think about what to do if the toast started to brown too much. To take it out of the oven ( no toaster when the stories were written).

            But the thinking person/doctor should be standing back and reviewing the disease presentation, the body as a whole. Even if this means hitting the books at night and acquiring more knowledge.
            If some physicians have been able to achieve this, others can as well.
            In recent years, more and more scientists and physicians are reevaluating everything they were taught in medical school. The patients they treat very often find their incurable diseases, syndromes, fading away. Perhaps not cured, but improved to a point where life is enjoyable again.

            Out of interest, Johnabetts, whereabouts are you located?
            Previous Numerous IPL.
            Supplements: High dose Niacinamide, Vit K2, low dose Vit A. Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Mod- dose B's. Low dose zinc. Testing Quercetin.

            Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA 2%, ethyl ascorbate 2%.

            Treating for gut dysbiosis.(This is helping).
            Previous GAPS diet. Have now introduced lots of fibre.
            Fermented Foods. Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.
            Oral Colostrum. Helps reduce food reactions.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Mistica View Post

              Out of interest, Johnabetts, whereabouts are you located?
              I'm in the South of England. Near the juncture of Surrey, Sussex and Hampshire.

              Comment


              • #8
                Mistica, we are conditioned to think that Doctors are the best and brightest among us but that is not the case, for the most part. These are not the people who observe and come to their own conclusion, noticing patterns that do not fit the "theory" they have been taught and then begin to try to discover what is truly going on. These are the people who were best at memorizing facts, being obedient and disciplined, and doing what is expected of them. These are the people who survived the torturous hazing and brain washing of med school and residency. They did not "wash out," they submitted to an abusive and corrupt system. They are not dumb, they are just the weakest among us.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Research suggests rosacea subtypes may be different conditions

                  Starlike,
                  Getting through medical school and residency is not described by many as weakness since it is an accomplishment not obtained by the faint of heart. Most respect what physicians go through to get M.D. behind their name. Doctors are nevertheless still all too human but the idea of going through all those hoops isn't for sissies.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    You are of course correct Brady, on one level. It takes a great deal of intestinal fortitude to get through medical or nursing school. Just like it does to get through basic training and beyond for the military. However it takes a special kind of strength to say every thing I have believed in and fought so hard for is wrong and I am hurting people so a special few can get rich, I will not go on doing that, and put your guns down. The systems (both medical and military) are set up to drum the kind of people who can do that, or even think like that, right out and early in the process. Did you know that some of the standard medicines used to treat cancer, called chemo therapy, are insecticides from the 50's? How can anyone in good conscience give that to someone?

                    Ugh! Anyway.. I could go on and on.. maybe in another thread. Thank you for disagreeing with out being disagreeable. I have other threads of yours I intend to reply yo.. just waiting for the brain power to come back around. LOL

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Research suggests rosacea subtypes may be different conditions

                      Starlite,
                      I understand your point. To some degree you are quite correct With the degree of money involved in the pharmaceutical companies And their influence on physicians And as you mentioned the industrial military complex has great deal of influence on the world However not all physicians are bad as this thread is pointing out. Dr. Powell is pointing out how the subtype classification system is wanting. The original committee that subclassed Rosacea into subtypes admitted that it is based on morphology rather than on nosology. We should appreciate the work of physicians like Dr. Powell. They are not all bad.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Not at all Brady... not all bad at all. There are many brilliant, compassionate, and passionate physicians who stick their necks out in spite of the risks to their careers for doing so. In fact I think there are very few "bad" Doctors. The vast majority have good intentions but have been brain washed and bullied and coned. My goal in stirring up the thoughts on our relationships with Doctors is to stop seeing them as someone who knows better then us about our bodies. Almost everyone who has been hurt by a medical error knew something was wrong but over rode their own best interests because the "Doctor said to." We have to think about them differently now. We have to stop believing that we had a good Doc visit if we came away after 15 minutes with a prescription for the latest and greatest drug. WE have to read and study and ask good questions... hard pressing questions. It's us that has to make the medical system change.


                        Like you are doing BTW

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Starlite View Post
                          Not at all Brady... not all bad at all. There are many brilliant, compassionate, and passionate physicians who stick their necks out in spite of the risks to their careers for doing so. In fact I think there are very few "bad" Doctors. The vast majority have good intentions but have been brain washed and bullied and coned. My goal in stirring up the thoughts on our relationships with Doctors is to stop seeing them as someone who knows better then us about our bodies. Almost everyone who has been hurt by a medical error knew something was wrong but over rode their own best interests because the "Doctor said to." We have to think about them differently now. We have to stop believing that we had a good Doc visit if we came away after 15 minutes with a prescription for the latest and greatest drug. WE have to read and study and ask good questions... hard pressing questions. It's us that has to make the medical system change.


                          Like you are doing BTW

                          And I like what you are saying too. That is why I formed the RRDi. I didn't like the way the NRS runs their organization. I think a non profit should be just that, non profit, that is what the name means. And if enough rosaceans would ban together in the thousands they can give a voice to the medical community. As it stands now, according to the NRS in their Form 990, they have 75,000 supporters. That is why physicians listen to the NRS and parrot their trigger list of avoiding wine and spicy food and 16 million Americans who have rosacea. Powell, in the article mentioned at the beginning of this thread questions the numbers the NRS publishes:

                          "Regarding rosacea's prevalence, "It seems to be at least as common as psoriasis," although statistics from different countries vary, Dr. Powell says. "In the United States, for example, the National Rosacea Society produced data suggesting there were 14 million patients. This was based on a survey of individuals who self-reported rosacea." However, he says, this methodology creates problems because many patients with facial redness assume they have rosacea when they might not." [the NRS now says the number is 16 million]

                          The trigger list the NRS produces is also based upon 'self-reported' surveys. The RRDi has a long way to go to catch up to the NRS but we don't have paid staff nor paid private contractors. We are all volunteer.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            In continuation with the theme of this thread...'getting physicians to wake up to new ideas', take a look at the following article by Dr Borody.
                            He is my specialist. He is very outspoken and my consultation with him was rather daunting to say the least.

                            Here is a quote from an article which gives you some idea of his mindset.



                            "It's similar to any new theory or practice when it's introduced - is very hard to get old dogs to learn new tricks. Little interest has been shown within the pharmaceutical industry. Young doctors are very much on board with FMT, it's the old farts who are holding us back".

                            *************

                            I have numerous health issues and the current goal is to treat me with a FMT. I am an experiment.
                            I am currently taking antimicrobials which are poorly absorbed from the gut.

                            Incidentally, one of the studies refered to in the article is recruiting now - in Amsterdam.
                            Previous Numerous IPL.
                            Supplements: High dose Niacinamide, Vit K2, low dose Vit A. Moderate Dose Vit C, Iodine, Taurine, Magnesium. Mod- dose B's. Low dose zinc. Testing Quercetin.

                            Skin Care: No Cleanser, ZZ cream mixed with Niacinamide gel 4% and LMW HA 2%, ethyl ascorbate 2%.

                            Treating for gut dysbiosis.(This is helping).
                            Previous GAPS diet. Have now introduced lots of fibre.
                            Fermented Foods. Intermittent fasting -16-18 hours.
                            Oral Colostrum. Helps reduce food reactions.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Mistica View Post
                              Little interest has been shown within the pharmaceutical industry.
                              Just the problem I have with my current development work. I am carrying out my own research into various dermatological products but it is next to impossible for the pharma giants to become interested. Is it because they cannot see gazillions of $$$$, £££, €€€ or whatever currency or do they still have the attitudes of the 1980s and the "not invented here" syndrome which was especially prevalent in the USA.

                              Comment

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